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If Obama’s Not A Socialist, Why Is He Now Targeting Insurance Rate Control?
Written By : William Teach

Dictionary definition of Socialism

a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.

Obviously, in practice, it is a bit more complicated than that, however, not much, and the primary point of delineation between Democratic Socialism and Democratic Liberalism (what is often called Classical Liberalism) is that the government is heavily involved with the economy, controlling and owning huge parts of the private sector. So, this couldn’t be socialism, could it?

President Obama will call for new government power to regulate insurance-rate increases as part of comprehensive changes to the health-care system that the White House will unveil on its Web site Monday, senior officials said.

The proposal — part of a package that a top official said will serve as a “starting point” for the bipartisan health summit Thursday — comes as Obama has pointed to recent rate increases as evidence that his proposed changes are necessary.

Ownership and control of GM, dictating pay at companies that took bailouts, and in some cases, trying to dictate pay for non-bailout companies. Add to that the Obamacare plans, which would see the government taking a huge controlling stake in the health care industry. Now we have Obama calling to control the practices of private insurance companies. Seems like socialism to me!

Of course, there is no concern that, if this flaccid idea were to pass, political abuse wouldn’t happen, correct? You wouldn’t see one company receive better regulated rates over another, causing the first company to be profitable, and the latter to go out of business, would you? We wouldn’t see investors dump their stock in insurance companies, because they thought to be unprofitable anymore, would we? We wouldn’t see insurance companies just close down, would we, because they are unprofitable? They wouldn’t do something like outsource as much of their workforce as they can to other countries in order to attempt to make a better profit, would we?

But, don’t call Obama a socialist.

Crossed at Pirate’s Cove

0
  • http://Kingfisher Kingfisher

    Awaiting typical denial of Obama’s socialism and daily “party of no” rant from Jack Shithead in 5…4…3…2…

  • Mr_e_m_t

    It can’t be socialism because that would be an attempt to overthrow the US government.
    As we know from the recent john hawkins poll, obama has not done anything worthy of being impeached over according to views held by popular conservative bloggers.
    You must be imagining the things people have been screaming about being wrong with this administration.
    If you aren’t careful next thing will be for you to question if obama has been lying…
    Then you might wonder if he was indeed telling the truth about his birth certificate. Then next thing will be for john “kung fu” hawkins to label you a kook like the rest of us, “birthers.”

  • http://PatriotPost.US bthewolf

    Posted by Mr_e_m_t
    2010-02-22 08:35:07

    Dude seriuosly, by defibition, ANY control of an industry, by regulating the manner, type, or quantity of distribution is SOCIALISM. Dictating what types of insurance the industry can sell is controlling the type and quantity, thus falls very CLEARLY under the definition of SOCIALISM. Nothing in COTUS gives Odrama or Congress the power to DO such things, these laws are being written are extraconstituional but no one in Washington is willing to stand up and SAY IT and make the rest understand.

  • Mr_e_m_t

    Just pointing out the obvious, you cant push socialism and also support the US government, both are in direct opposition to each other.

    But if you are looking for more to argue with, highlights from Drudgereport.com as of now are:

    BACKDOOR FIX: ‘Funds will be transferred to the Social Security Trust Funds’…
    PRESIDENT’S ‘HEALTHCARE’ PROPOSAL SUMMARY USES WORD ‘TAX’ 35 TIMES…
    ‘Increase in Fees on Brand Name Pharmaceuticals’…
    Broaden ‘Tax Base for High-Income Taxpayers’…
    Orders ‘Comprehensive Database’ On Health Claims…
    FORCED: ‘Raises percent of income assessment that individuals pay if they choose not to become insured’…

    Lower middle class is going to be crushed and sent into poverty and unemployment in order to avoid tax hell.

  • Mike_M

    It’s either socialism or its cousin, fascism. Everything in the bill and Obama’s proposals will make it impossible for insurance companies to operate independently.

    The government will force them to accept customers regardless of risk, which destroys a centuries old business model right off the bat. The government will set the medical loss ratio, which will dictate the percentage of revenue companies must spend on health care services. They’re going to control the rates customers pay, and doubtlessly the salaries of company managers and executives.

    They’re in essence going to turn health care into a publicly-regulated utility…a business model that kills innovation and competition, lowers quality, and leads to higher prices.

    Anybody want to go back to the early 1990′s era for telephone and computer service with costly long distance, almost no consumer choice, and little to no technological innovation? That’s going to be health care under the Obama Tax and Takeover Plan.

  • Jack Schite

    Socialism and fascism are opposite ends of the spectrum, unless you are Jonah Goldberg and you carefully pick and choose to omit the historical truth. Let’s put Goldberg’s tome up for scholarly analysis, shall we? It’s basically toilet paper.

    As for Obama the socialist, William is trying to claim one man can change the paradigm of the country so completely, to William Obama must have the power of Jesus Christ itself.

    The government role is to regulate business as it fosters it. Insurance is a social contract where risk is spread among people so individuals don’t bear the total cost. Skimming profits at the expense of coverage us basically unethical.

    Besides, when your side Ean the country you ran it into the ground.

    Payback’s a bitch.

  • http://guardian.blogdrive.com/ CavalierX

    It can’t be socialism because that would be an attempt to overthrow the US government.

    You’re deliberately confusing the issue. No one thinks Obama’s going to send tanks into Washington and declare himself Dictator. Whatever you call it, any move to centralise State control over private industries is antithetical to everything America stands for. It’s not so much overthrowing the government as subverting it.

  • http://guardian.blogdrive.com/ CavalierX

    Besides, when your side Ean the country

    Conservatives have not “run” the country in decades — if ever. Stop pretending that Republican and Conservative are synonyms. It just makes you look more foolish than you already do.

  • Mike_M

    “Socialism and fascism are opposite ends of the spectrum”

    No, not really. Socialism is the state control of land, industry, and business under a centralized authority. Fascist economics maintains the facade of private ownership, but chains business to the government through regulations, taxes, and strongarm tactics.

    Technically speaking, Obama’s agenda is more fascist than socialist since he’s really only nationalized General Motors, but has used legislation and strongarm tactics to barge his way into the financial firms and Chrysler.

    Obama may be creating history’s first example of a fascist republic. Fortunately the voters seem to have realized this and are voting Democrats out of office about as fast as possible. Thanks for opening the door for me to explain that in detail, by the way.

  • tblrk2006

    Payback’s a bitch.
    Posted by Jack Schite
    2010-02-22 09:47:01

    Why do you keep saying this?

  • http://PatriotPost.US bthewolf

    Socialism and fascism are opposite ends of the spectrum, unless you are Jonah Goldberg and you carefully pick and choose to omit the historical truth. Let’s put Goldberg’s tome up for scholarly analysis, shall we? It’s basically toilet paper.

    Wrong, wrong, wrong, completely and utterly WRONG. Facism and Socialsm are BROTHERs, not brother and sister. Right-wing govts call for little or NO control of business and the economy.

    As for Obama the socialist, William is trying to claim one man can change the paradigm of the country so completely, to William Obama must have the power of Jesus Christ itself.

    Well not exactly, Teach is saying this is what Odrama wants and what the Dems in Congress are WILLING to give him.

    The government role is to regulate business as it fosters it.

    Wrong, govts role is do NOTHING, unless the company has acted unfairly or fraudulently.

    Insurance is a social contract where risk is spread among people so individuals don’t bear the total cost. Skimming profits at the expense of coverage us basically unethical.

    Wrong insurance is a BUSINESS contract where the risks of expense are spread among the buyers to provide he a cost savings to the insured. Profit (less than 5% of total revenue for most health insurance companies), is the means by which the company inproves it services. There is NOTHING unethical about profit. However stealing from the rich to give the less rich is unethical, ammoral, and illegal.

    Besides, when your side Ean the country you ran it into the ground.

    Payback’s a bitch.
    Posted by Jack Schite
    2010-02-22 09:47:01

    There hasn’t been a truely conservative majority in the Fed since at least 1925, so I don’t see how this can be even remotely true.

  • http://WriteWinger WriteWinger

    Why do you keep saying this?
    Posted by tblrk2006

    Probably a “shout out” to a female significant in his life…

  • Mike_M

    “The government role is to regulate business as it fosters it.”

    Yes, in accordance with the Constitution…but regulate means regulate, not take over or operate.

    Hey, by the way, since the liberals seem to now be against national insurance exchanges in the name of state’s rights (that’s rich), has anybody told them that the Federal government has no authority to regulate intrastate business?

    All these fancy new taxes, takeovers, and mandates? Blatantly and totally unconstitutional, and unenforceable against insurance companies that don’t cross state lines.

    Obama’s bill is a huge farce unless an insurance company decided to take the bait and starts to sell nationally. Any company that continued to operate as an in-state entity could avoid all the taxes and mandates the liberals are so eager to enforce.

  • http://Kingfisher Kingfisher

    There is NOTHING unethical about profit.

    To the left, that is true only when they’re making the profit. That explains why the left intentionally ignores the entertainment industry’s enormous profits.

  • http://Kingfisher Kingfisher

    The government role is to regulate business as it fosters it.

    Problem is, the left is never interested in regulating government.

  • http://www.thepiratescove.us William_Teach

    It can’t be socialism because that would be an attempt to overthrow the US government.

    Not really, because Socialism is part of the Democracy model, and stresses open elections and government staying out of private lives. Classic Liberalism is in the center, Classic Conservatism is on the Right. American Conservatives are classic liberals, European conservatives are classic conservatives.

  • http://conservativebootcamp.com martinhale

    Jacqui, you too funny –

    Let’s put Goldberg’s tome up for scholarly analysis, shall we?

    OK, let’s. Get ready for that scholarly analysis. Here it comes…wait for it…it’s big…really big…

    It’s basically toilet paper.

    That was your example of “scholarly analysis”? ROFLMAO. What a joke you are Jacqui.

    Hint: You were a better troll when you didn’t try to explain yourself. Now, when you explain you ‘thinking’, it’s apparent that there isn’t much going on between your ears, intellect-wise. Kind of like your four word “scholarly analysis”.

    You too funny, Jacqui.

  • whats_up

    There is NOTHING unethical about profit

    Posted by bthewolf
    2010-02-22 10:27:58

    Depends how you go about making said profit. Toyota and there skimping on safety to make a profit comes to mind.

  • tblrk2006

    Depends how you go about making said profit. Toyota and there skimping on safety to make a profit comes to mind.
    Posted by whats_up
    2010-02-22 11:35:12

    A. Nobody knows, except toyota, what and if they skimped on anything. This is another form of democrat class warfare to sell more govt motors cars. All we have are claims.

    B. That is in no way similar to insurance and what you THINK is going on there. Remember when you said we cannot judge the entire canadian system based on the tonsil kid and the premier coming here for heart surgery, then you went ahead and said everybody in the usa dies or goes BK from our system……remember that?

  • tblrk2006

    There is NOTHING unethical about profit

    Posted by bthewolf
    2010-02-22 10:27:58

    Depends how you go about making said profit.
    Posted by whats_up
    2010-02-22 11:35:12

    Guilty until proven innocent?

  • http://guardian.blogdrive.com/ CavalierX

    Depends how you go about making said profit.

    Those who break the law ought to be punished. That’s the entire role of government in business. Period.

  • whats_up

    A. Nobody knows, except toyota, what and if they skimped on anything. This is another form of democrat class warfare to sell more govt motors cars. All we have are claims.

    Posted by tblrk2006
    2010-02-22 11:50:24

    Well we have an internal memo that says otherwise. Are you okay with Toyota doing this? Will you defend their right to skimp on safety in the name of making a profit?

  • whats_up

    B. That is in no way similar to insurance and what you THINK is going on there. Remember when you said we cannot judge the entire canadian system based on the tonsil kid and the premier coming here for heart surgery, then you went ahead and said everybody in the usa dies or goes BK from our system……remember that?

    Posted by tblrk2006
    2010-02-22 11:50:24

    NO, because I said no such thing.

  • http://guardian.blogdrive.com/ CavalierX

    Will you defend their right to skimp on safety in the name of making a profit?

    If they broke a law, they ought to be punished. Why is this not clear to you?

  • DrEvil

    Progressivism is the American version of Fascism and National Socialism. The One (PBUH) are Ptogressives, it is just that simple. They appear to believe that industry exists to serve the intersts of the State. What are excessive or windfall profits? Who decides what is excessive? You? Me? The government? If I am invested in a specific company than there is no such thing as excessive profits. Only to an anti-business Progressive is profit somehow bad.

    Have an Evil day

  • http://PatriotPost.US bthewolf

    Well we have an internal memo that says otherwise. Are you okay with Toyota doing this? Will you defend their right to skimp on safety in the name of making a profit?
    Posted by whats_up
    2010-02-22 12:30:46

    And then they are responsible and will be held accountable for their actions. Either by settling with the govt for any laws they violated and settling with their customers either by fixing the problem or via what ever settlements the courts or arbitration reach. JUST LIKE THE INSURANCE COMPANIES DO NOW WHEN THEY VIOLATE THEIR CONTRACT WITH THE CUSTOMER.

  • http://TheNixonTape.Blogspot.Com Dick_Nixon

    Will you defend their right to skimp on safety in the name of making a profit?
    Posted by whats_up
    2010-02-22 12:30:46

    WIll you defend your comment that David Duke voted for Bush?

  • Mike_M

    “Toyota and there skimping on safety to make a profit comes to mind.”

    The only evidence of that right now is a memo, and we’re still ostensibly enought of a democracy that displying hubris against the government isn’t a crime…yet.

    If Toyota jeopardized safety through actions or omissions, they should be punished.

    But the real crux of the matter here seems to be another leaked memo that describes the Obama Administration and Congress as activist, the regulatory environment as hostile, and the company itself girding to do battle with legions of politically-motivated government lawyers. In the wake of the rape of GM and Chrysler, can you blame them?

  • http://rightwingrocker.blogspot.com RightWingRocker

    Socialism and fascism are opposite ends of the spectrum, unless you are Jonah Goldberg and you carefully pick and choose to omit the historical truth.

    Shows what you know.

    Game. Set. Match.

    RWR
    http://www.rightwingrocker.com

  • http://rightwingrocker.blogspot.com RightWingRocker

    David Duke voted for Bush

    As if that means anything at all.

    Is it any kind of big deal that Robert Byrd voted for Obama?

    Oh, and by the way, how does anyone know, and why does anyone care? Legally, it’s no one’s business in either case but Duke’s or Byrd’s.

    RWR
    http://www.rightwingrocker.com

  • Mr_e_m_t

    Government has no place in regulating private business beyond the limits of the judicial branch where it comes to enforcing criminal law.
    Fascism, communism, socialism, “nationalism”, are not just subversive, they are treasonous and have no place in our government any more than imperialism and totalitarianism.

    I do solemnly swear that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.

    We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

  • tblrk2006

    NO, because I said no such thing.
    Posted by whats_up
    2010-02-22 12:33:55

    Im pretty sure it was you…..although might have been jack shite. All the same in the end.

  • http://TheNixonTape.Blogspot.Com Dick_Nixon

    Posted by RightWingRocker
    2010-02-22 13:32:53

    You should ask whats_up, as he made the attempt to smear Bush as a white supremacist that Duke voted for. Three years ago, and whats_up has never provided proof or retracted his claim.

    Thus explaining his zero credibility on any issue. In fact, the only one he has any possible knowledge of is gay marriage.

  • RWDavidD

    No, don’t call him a Socialist. Call him what he is–a Fascist.

  • Power_System_Oper

    If Sarah Palin were not a socialist, why did she, while governor, bargain to increase the tolls that oil companies pay to the state of Alaska for extracting oil within Alaska rather than seeking to overturn the Alaskan State Consitution which states that the ownership and control of Alaska’s oil is vested in the state of Alaska.

  • Mr_e_m_t

    Right because socialism is totally defined as “taking money from private companies for the privilige of making money from resources native to the land you are governing” found that somewhere in the wikiverse….

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