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Old Paul Krugman: The Debt Is No Problem! Spend More! New Paul Krugman: We Can’t Pay Off This Huge Debt!
Written By : John Hawkins

Barack Obama and the Democrats in Congress have gone on the largest spending spree in recorded human history and all the while, Paul Krugman has not just been cheering them on, he’s been shouting “Spend more” at the top of his lungs. Don’t believe me? Then just take a look at these Krugman quotes,

It’s politically fashionable to rant against government spending and demand fiscal responsibility. But right now, increased government spending is just what the doctor ordered, and concerns about the budget deficit should be put on hold.

How much money can the government actually spend in rescuing the economy? The answer is a lot. It’s not unlimited. A trillion here, a trillion there and soon you’re talking about real money. Vast countries with stable governments, which is us, can borrow up to 100 percent, more than that of GDP, and you work that out – we probably have $10 trillion of running room if we have to use it. I don’t want to get there, but uh, we’ve got a long ways to go.

But what about all that debt we’re incurring? That’s a bad thing, but it’s important to have some perspective. Economists normally assess the sustainability of debt by looking at the ratio of debt to G.D.P. And while $9 trillion is a huge sum, we also have a huge economy, which means that things aren’t as scary as you might think.

…Now, this assumes that the U.S. government’s credit will remain good so that it’s able to borrow at relatively low interest rates. So far, that’s still true. Despite the prospect of big deficits, the government is able to borrow money long term at an interest rate of less than 3.5 percent, which is low by historical standards. People making bets with real money don’t seem to be worried about U.S. solvency.

The numbers tell you why. According to the White House projections, by 2019, net federal debt will be around 70 percent of G.D.P. That’s not good, but it’s within a range that has historically proved manageable for advanced countries, even those with relatively weak governments. In the early 1990s, Belgium — which is deeply divided along linguistic lines — had a net debt of 118 percent of G.D.P., while Italy — which is, well, Italy — had a net debt of 114 percent of G.D.P. Neither faced a financial crisis.

So is there anything to worry about? Yes, but the dangers are political, not economic.

Translation: Don’t listen to these conservatives and Tea Party yahoos! We can borrow lots more money and not have any problems at all.

Well, guess what? Suddenly, Mr. “concerns about the budget deficit should be put on hold” has shifted gears:

In the end, I’d argue, what must happen is an effective default on a significant part of debt, one way or another. The default could be implicit, via a period of moderate inflation that reduces the real burden of debt; that’s how World War II cured the depression. Or, if not, we could see a gradual, painful process of individual defaults and bankruptcies, which ends up reducing overall debt.

And that’s what is happening now: as this story in today’s Times points out, the main force behind the gratifying decline in consumer debt appears to be default rather than thrift.

So basically, we can do this cleanly or we can do this ugly. And ugly is the way we’re going.

Shorter Paul Krugman? Pay off all the money I said we should spend? That’s crazy talk!

In other words, everybody who listened to Paul Krugman? This is Animal House. You’re Flounder. This just happened to you (Excuse the language).

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  • UFKA_Smithwick

    Proving once again that anyone who claims economics is a science ought to be assigned a straight-jacket and powerful anti-psychotic drugs.

    I suppose we could try to beat the money out of those who voted to spend impossible amounts without end. It may not work but it's guaranteed to make everyone feel better (except for those idiots getting beaten of course).

  • tblrk2006

    The only answer they have is class warfare and taking more from those that they “think” can handle it…..and even then, as Danny from yesterday pointed out, it still wont solve the problem. That begs the question…….why take it then Danny? Just to “stick it” to those rich people?…..b/c thats all your going to accomplish. What is needed is an END to govt programs and agencies and the massive welfare and entitlement lifestyle. Then, as joe biden put it, its time to pay your fair share and be a part of this thing. FLAT TAX.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Danny-Browning/1666222445 Danny Browning

      Sigh, you need both. You're not going to cut your way out of this deficit, just like you're not going to tax your way out of it. And sticking it to the spenders in society via a flat tax is a surefire way to keep your economy depressed. But you'd know that if you ever actually looked at the numbers, instead of just swallowing someone's rhetoric.

      To make it easy, here's some basic numbers you can use to compute with. Take a population of 100 people, 90 that make $100 and are taxed at 10%, 10 that make $1000 and are taxed at 30%. Both spend 50% of after tax income on living expenses, and the 90 save 2%, while the 10 save 40% of after tax income. Then compare it to a FLAT TAX of 20%. Tell me what you find for amount of discretionary spending available.

      • http://www.patriotpost.com bthewolf

        Danny, Stop making an idiot out yourself. You're not convincing anyone with your bad analogies and screeds.

        Your example about a flat tax assumes that everyone's spending needs are the same, and assumes much about how willing they are to make changes to their budget should their taxes change. Your assumptions also don't take into account how most proposals for a flat tax exempt all income up to a certain point, usually related to 'the poverty level.'

        So spare us your indignation. We all know what you feel, and what you think, you're not going to convince anyone that your Sacred Cows are more important than ours.

        • http://www.facebook.com/people/Danny-Browning/1666222445 Danny Browning

          So I take it you didn't like how the hypothetical example came out? If so, you really wouldn't like how the real example comes out. Where, with a progressive tax, you pay 25% on income over a certain threshold, where with a flat tax, you pay 22% on income over a lower threshold.

          You are howling about tax increases now, wait till you see your bill under a flat tax.

          • http://www.patriotpost.com bthewolf

            Mine goes down, depending on the threshold, but the threshold can pretty low before it goes up. And who said the rate was going to be 22%? Or is that an arbitrary number?

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Danny-Browning/1666222445 Danny Browning

            That's pretty much the rate projections show as equivalent to our current tax code, without factoring any positive or negative economic impacts, with I think first $30,000 not taxed. I think it might be a couple points low, but it at least provides a starting point.

            It still leaves about 45% of the country not paying taxes though.

          • http://www.patriotpost.com bthewolf

            That projection also assumes constant or increasing spending, something that is not guaranteed.

      • mightysamurai

        You're not going to cut your way out of this deficit

        You must live in some alternate universe were spending less money magically increases your debt somehow.

      • http://www.wordaroundthenet.com Christopher Taylor

        I can't understand why anyone with the slightest shred of mathematical and economic comprehension would say that we can't cut our way out of this deficit.

  • baoxian

    Krugman gives away the game in the latter section. What liberals really want to do is follow the German model: inflate their way out of debt. This has two side effects: utter ruin for the middle class, and a necessity for massive government seizure and management of wealth (two things they want anyways).

    Look what Germany did with the Rentenmark and you'll have a pretty good idea how the liberals plan to leverage Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to stabilize the economy after a period of planned hyperinflation. The results would not be pretty for the American people, although it would certainly preserve the power of the ruling class while consolidating just about all real property in their hands.

    There are really no more illusions about what these people are after. We'd better damn well stop them in November.

    • UFKA_Smithwick

      I wonder if defaulting may prove to be the best solution at this point. We're so in debt right now that it seems unlikely we will ever pay it off. Obama has poured gasoline on a problem that has been burning for decades now.

      So we default and now no one will loan us money again. This may be a silver lining as we've proven we cannot regulate our expenses; it would force us to live within our means.

      Not ideal of course but we're rapidly running out of options.

      • baoxian

        Nah. The best case would be China putting us on notice that they will cease buying our debt in exactly three years. Would gives us a manageable deadline to balance the budget without chaos.

        But seeing as how that would never happen, a default would be extremely ugly and would spill over into the consumer market. Interest rates would skyrocket. The government in a panic, would doubtlessly begin seizing private assets (real estate, retirement accounts) to balance the books. We would probably see big tariffs slapped on US exports and probably an oil embargo. Not to mention the political and probable military repercussions.

        The best scenario likely to happen is a rollback of the deficit through responsible cuts in spending. The lowest hanging fruit is entitlements for able bodied adults, government bureaucracy, and foreign military bases (not troop levels). We could reduce spending by $400 billion in those areas easily and take a huge step towards a balanced budget.

        It's a lot easier to walk away from the mortgage than to work extra hours and stick to a budget, but if we want to remain a world leader, that's the route we have to go.

        • UFKA_Smithwick

          Well yes, being responsible would be the best option.

          I just don't see that happening. If it were that simple we wouldn't be in this mess in the first place.

          Everyone agrees that this is a problem but no one is willing to vote for cuts to their own personal slice of the pie. The net result is we get continued spending *increases* when we desperately need to be making cuts or at the very least maintaining the size of government.

          http://carriedaway.blogs.com/carried_away/2003/10/us_government_s.html

          At no point have we had sustained decreases in spending as a percent of GDP (except immediately after wwII but that was inevitable). We're already in a hole and seem intent on digging faster than ever.

          • baoxian

            Well I still choose default over becoming a dictatorship (one or the other has to give if we just keep spending), but it still means we're done as a world superpower. The dollar would go bye-bye, our standard of living would take a huge leap backwards, and we would rightly be blamed for setting off a global depression…after our creditors nationalize every piece of US-owned property worldwide.

            WWII pulled FDR's bacon out of the fire during the Great Depression. I'd rather not go through another world war just to get out of paying our bills.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Danny-Browning/1666222445 Danny Browning

            Since everyone has their pet projects or personal funding lobbies, it brings us back to tax increases. You might be able to reduce the budget by 10% if people really buckle down, but you'll still be in a hole with current tax rates. Yep, it's not fair, but neither was passing the cuts in the first place via reconciliation when we had outstanding debt. Time to pay the piper.

          • baoxian

            The Bush Tax increases led to an increase in government revenue.

  • TheDickNixon

    It's funny (pathetic really) how his opinion changed when the lightbringer occupied the oval office.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Danny-Browning/1666222445 Danny Browning

    Seriously? One is talking about government debt, the other is talking about consumer debt.

    You really don't want a government defaulting their way out of debt. However, with our bankruptcy laws and non-recourse mortgages, default for an individual is an almost preferable solution in this economy, since it will more readily return that individual to good consumer status.

    • http://www.patriotpost.com bthewolf

      Yeah which then puts the rest of the public on the line for that consumers bad financial decisions, just like the govts mishandling of debt puts us on the line for it's spending!!! Great way to look at things, Danny.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Danny-Browning/1666222445 Danny Browning

        “almost preferable solution”

        I think that paying it off will be better over the long run, but it will make the economic recovery take much longer.

  • http://www.wordaroundthenet.com Christopher Taylor

    Krugman just writes whatever the left is talking about lately and tries to make it sound impressive with economist jargon. He contradicts himself pretty regularly (when Bush was president he was hysterical about the debt, for example). He's just making money, not writing anything he believes in. As an economist he's much more serious and plausible. As a columnist, he's just vomiting leftist pablum.

  • yup

    I have a question and I haven't been able to first an answer. But has are debt to GDP ever been at or above 100%?

  • yup

    I wonder if he owns a lot of gold and wants to make a killing off of inflation.

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