Talking With Joseph Nassralla: The Man Police Escorted From The Ground Zero Mosque Protest

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Talking With Joseph Nassralla: The Man Police Escorted From The Ground Zero Mosque Protest

Written By : John Hawkins

Last week-end, Robert Spencer from Jihad Watch and my friend Pamela Geller from Atlas Shrugs helped organize a roughly 10,000 person strong protest against the mega-mosque that’s being built at Ground Zero. This is a noble cause and Pamela, Robert, and the other people at Stop Islamization of America who are fighting the good fight against this mosque deserve your support.

It’s worth noting that this is an even bigger issue than most realize because of Islam’s cultural traditions. As Andrew Mellon correctly noted at Big Government, “Muslims have been building mosques for centuries as symbols of conquest and dominance, and this one in particular will mark the first to stand on US soil.” If this mosque is built, Jihadis across the globe will treat it as the most significant victory for radical Islam and Al-Qaeda since 9/11. Is that really a message that New York of all places should want to send?

That being said, there was an unfortunate event that marred the Ground Zero protest on Sunday and it has gotten a lot of attention. Here’s the story as it appeared at North Jersey.com,

At one point, a portion of the crowd menacingly surrounded two Egyptian men who were speaking Arabic and were thought to be Muslims.

“Go home,” several shouted from the crowd.

“Get out,” others shouted.

In fact, the two men Joseph Nassralla
and Karam El Masry — were not Muslims at all. They turned out to be Egyptian Coptic Christians who work for a California-based Christian satellite TV station called “The Way.” Both said they had come to protest the mosque.

“I’m a Christian,” Nassralla shouted to the crowd, his eyes bulging and beads of sweat rolling down his face.

But it was no use. The protesters had become so angry at what they thought were Muslims that New York City police officers had to rush in and pull Nassralla and El Masry to safety.

“I flew nine hours in an airplane to come here,” a frustrated Nassralla said afterward.

I wrote about this yesterday and quite naturally condemned that behavior in the strongest terms. Later during the day as I was doing my friend Jaz McKay’s radio show, we discussed the issue and he wondered if the story was true. After all, some of the reporting on conservative protests over the last couple of years has been flat out inaccurate. That seemed to be a fair point, so I decided to follow-up on the story.

After doing some footwork, I managed to track down Joseph Nassralla. He’s a Coptic Christian who emigrated here from Egypt. He also runs The Way, a Christian satellite TV station.

Right off the bat, I asked him if the description of the incident given by North Jersey.com was accurate.

Regrettably, he said that it was. He said that they were talking to people back at the studio in Arabic, some people in the crowd overheard, thought they were Muslim infiltrators who were there to disrupt the event, and became increasingly hostile despite their attempts to explain. At one point, Joseph Nassralla told me he was shoved and his camera was knocked out of his hand. He said he was worried that things might have really gotten out of hand if the police hadn’t escorted him and Karam El Masry away.

Although the whole incident isn’t on camera, Joseph Nassralla was kind enough to provide some footage from the rally. This video shows Joseph Nassralla and Karam El Masry being escorted out of the crowd by the police. That’s followed by El Masry giving an inspired speech about the mosque to a small group of people on the periphery of the rally.

This video features Joseph Nassralla and Pastor Sami Masry speaking on the edge of the rally about what a terrible idea it is to build a mosque at Ground Zero,

Joseph Nassralla told me he’d been persecuted for his faith in Egypt. He said eight of his Christian friends had actually been killed. When I asked him why he thought they wanted to build the mosque on that spot, he told me,

I think they want to build the Mosque right there to slap Americans in the face. It’s their way to show a victory for Islam. They knocked the towers down and they’re building an Islamic center in the same place to show they’re powerful.

From there, we talked a bit more about the rally. Although he wasn’t happy about the way he was treated, Mr. Nassralla seemed mainly to be chagrined that there had been such a misunderstanding. He also noted that after hearing about the incident, Robert Spencer personally phoned him to apologize for what had happened.

Moreover, he added that he would have liked to have spoken at the rally, but it didn’t happen. So, I asked him, “If Robert or Pamela could arrange for you to speak at the next rally, would you be willing to fly in from California to do it?” He responded,

Yes, I would. I love America. In Egypt, I couldn’t speak out. They would kill me.

After I finished my conversation with Joseph Nassralla, I got in touch with Pamela Geller to see what she had to say about the incident.

She told me that she was surprised that there had been a problem and noted that there were other Coptic Christians at the rally and even a few Muslims and none of them had any problems. She also noted that it was a big rally, that she regretted there was a problem, and she added,

“If I knew that was going on, I would have said something. If I had the numbers of the people shouting at them, I would call them right now and rip them a new one.”

Incidentally, if you know Pamela, you know that’s not just idle chatter. She means it.

I also informed Pamela about my conversation with Joseph Nassralla and his affirmative response to my question about speaking at the next rally against the Ground Zero mosque. Her response?

I would absolutely love to have him speak at the next protest.

So, you heard it here first, folks. Joseph Nassralla will be speaking at the next Ground Zero Mosque protest and my guess is that the people who’ve been using him to attack the people fighting the mosque probably won’t like him as much after they hear what he has to say from the stage.

Update #1: Joseph Nassralla has released a statement that’s been published on Atlas Shrugs. His statement generally lines up with what he told me, although it seems a bit tamer,

There was a minor incident at the rally that was blown out of proportion, when my partner , Mr. Karam El Masry, and I were distributing material with some Quran verses and we were also speaking Arabic thus we were mistaken by a few people in the huge crown, for being Muslims infiltrators trying to disrupt the event. This misunderstanding was clarified when we explained who we were and that we are there to support the crowd against the building of the mosque. I was a little frustrated initially for being identified as a Muslim infiltrator, but was glad that the issue was resolved later. My partner, Mr. El Masry, was even able to freely speak to the crowd after our identity was clarified. He explained how Christians are tortured, killed and oppressed in Egypt at the hands of Muslims who are encouraged to persecute Christians from the pulpit of mosques by Muslim preachers.

The reason I am writing to you, is because I am very disappointed in the mainstream media who used this minor incident to make a blanket generalization about all the attendees of the rally as Muslim haters.This kind of generalization was unfair to the good American people who legitimately stand against the building of a mosque next to ground zero and who are against Islamist agenda in the US. I am very well aware of such an agenda which has destroyed the Christian and Jewish existence in the Middle East.

The same mainstream media who denounces painting all Muslims with a broad brush, is doing the same thing they claim to stand against. They shamelessly use our incident to paint with a broad brush that everyone in the rally was a Muslim hater. I want to make it clear that we are not haters of Muslims, but we are against the Islamist agenda in America, the same agenda that drove us out of our homeland Egypt. We have the right to expose Muslim hate and oppression against us, the minorities in the Middle East who are oppressed on a daily basis by the Muslim majority. This mosque should never be built next to ground zero, it is an insult to the memory of the 3000 fellow Americans.

I’m glad to see that this whole thing has been cleared up because it’s a distraction from the real issue, which is the construction of a mega-mosque at Ground Zero.

howardzinn

“mega-mosque that's being built at Ground Zero.”

Its being built two blocks away. Sorry (not really) that its on the same peninsula as Ground Zero, but its not the only mosque nor will it be. Why dont you protest in front of a Catholic Church for raping children?
D-Vega

So if he would have been muslim, and supporting the right to build a community center or mosque within blocks from Ground Zero, then the way people treated him would have been okay.

son

I have to yet to see anyone on the right condemn this behavior outright, rather than with the “but he's a Christian” conditional, Stan.

D-Vega

This wasn't me. Someone is being a groupie, again.

Mr. EMT

It would have been expected due to the provocative nature of the act.

Like i said, let's watch you put on a kippah and walk up to a muslim rally and see what complaints you come up with.

D-Vega

“It would have been expected due to the provocative nature of the act.”

To a hateful rightwinger, just walking down a street and observing a protest can lead to intimidation justifiably because it's “provocative”.

I don't know where you live, but that doesn't fly in NYC.

http://profiles.yahoo.com/u/ELCWV5ANDUEJ5D5PB35FL2LZ6Y Bildo

Enough with the faux outrage over the hypothetical discrimination, Vega.

Yes, we are outraged because those men traveled to the site to help support he cause and were mistakenly treated badly. I feel badly for them.

If they had been Muslims, there to counter-protest, then no, I would have zero sympathy for them. Their sole purpose at an event like that would have been to stir up trouble, and they would have deserved whatever trouble they were able to stir.

So no, I really don't give a damn if a hypothetical Muslim would have gotten his hypothetical feelings hurt if, hypothetically, the crowd had started shouting at him. I, hypothetically, would most definitely say that he had it coming.

Brianna

“Their sole purpose at an event like that would have been to stir up trouble, and they would have deserved whatever trouble they were able to stir.”

No violence. We are better than that.

D-Vega

The rally was also no where nears 10,000 people. Maybe 1,000 people. Even the generous photo pictured is no where above 1,000 people. 10,000 people would have at least a few blocks long.

StanW

New York police estimated the crowd at around 5,000. But that is no match for the all-knowing Vega “Because I Said So” method.

D-Vega

Really, Stan? Where exactly did the police estimate that?

You are parroting Atlas Shrugs, which first cited that number.

Anyone looking at the photos can clearly see it was no where near even 5,000, Stan. Let alone 10,000. 10K people would have shut down the entire street.

StanW

Were you at the protest, Vega? Did you see it first hand? NO

You saw a picture and used your usual “Because I Said So” idiocy. Your lies are getting more boring every day!

D-Vega

I saw local coverage of the protest, Stan. And even the shown photos don't show anywhere near 5,000, let alone 10,000. Maybe it was 1,000 people.

Why is it the rightwing turns any protest into a fish story?

If the police estimated the crowd at 5,000, it should be pretty easy to confirm that, right? Not a conservative site saying “some police guy or some guy in a uniform somewhere estimated some huge number”

Just like the ridiculous “2 million” number from the D.C. protest, there's always some mysterious police officer or firefighter who estimates these crowds.
StanW

And there are plenty of dumbass Liberal jerks like you who deliberately underestimate the crowd in a pathetic attempt to dimish it's importance.

You think you can be taken at face value with your estimates just because you say so? Do your own damn research and prove the crowd was less than 1,000 as you keep saying.
D-Vega

It's to the right to prove that there were more than 1,000 people there, Stan. As you all are making the assertion.

Local media estimate it about 1,000, but you won't accept their figures.

You only accept the figures from your own echo chamber.

But if as you say the police estimated it at 5,000, then it should be easy to produce the statement from the NYPD. They are very good at making those things official.

So since the right is asserting that number, I'll await the citation from the police. So you are the one who said the police said that, then you should take the point in production.

I'm waiting.
StanW

I saw two articles on the protest, Vega. Both (CNN & Fox) said the police estimated the crowd at 5,000. But an official spokesman for the police said they don't do crowd estimations. The CNN article went on to say that their reporter on the scene put the esitmate at 200-300 people. You are claiming it was aroun 1,000. I'll await your strong condemnation of CNN for deliberately underestimating the crowd in the fact of the hard proof of the Vega “Because I saw a picture and I said so” estimate of 1,000.
D-Vega

The please show me the articles, Stan. I saw at least two that estimated it at much lower numbers – The NY Daily News and CNN.

Here is the link to CNN:
http://edition.cnn.com/2010/US/06/06/new.york.g…

Here is the Daily News:
http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2010/06/07/…

So one of your citations is already shot to shit. This is not “Vega says so”, it's common sense and actual citations.

I search on Fox News for a story on it, and found NONE.

So please, show me a story that doesn't cite Gellar or Spencer and states even 5,000. Better yet, show me where the police said it was 5,000.

Lastly, the CNN reporter said he was there for the first 45 minutes. That would make sense, since there was only about 1,000 total for the entire protest.
StanW

CNN says 200-300, when that is clearly wrong and you believe them. You have proven NOTHING other that your ability to be a pompous ass.
D-Vega

CNN said their reporter comfirmed 200-300 in the first 45 minutes of the rally.

Don't try to accuse someone of lying just because you reflexively defended a now proven liar.

And YOU said you saw CNN had it at 5,000. Where is that article, Stan?
StanW

No I did not, Vega. Learn not to lie.

I said the CNN Article had the 5,000 figure in it, but then said it's own reported put the number at 200-300. It's in the very artuicle you already sited.
D-Vega

I saw two articles on the protest, Vega. Both (CNN & Fox) said the police estimated the crowd at 5,000.

No wonder you defend this liar and hater, Stan. It's because you are a liar too.
StanW

And that is true Vega. That's what the article said.

So have a Coke and a smile and go screw yourself!
D-Vega

The article didn't say the police, the article said Gellar.

You said both CNN and Fox HAD THE POLICE saying it was 5,000.

That was a lie. Gellar is a liar. Spencer is liar.
StanW

BULLSHIT!

Gellar said IN BOTH ARTICLES that the police told her the number. That is what I said and that is the TRUTH! You can dispute the number all you want with your magical Vega “I saw a Picture on TV” vision. But Gellar got the number of the Police… PERIOD!
D-Vega

No, you didn't. You said “the police” and then “CNN and Fox” said the police said…

Stop lying, Stan. The facts are out. The rightwing has traditionally never been able to get huge numbers at protests, so now whenever they have any kind of protest, they grossly overestimate the number and then cite the police as the source so it seems official.

When really its a lie.
StanW

WHY DO YOU THINK IT IS A LIE, VEGA?
D-Vega

BECAUSE THEY ARE THE ONLY SOURCES OF THOSE NUMBERS, STAN. TRY TO LOOK AT IT OBJECTIVELY FOR A MOMENT.
StanW

OBJECTIVELY???? Are you SERIOUS?

Where is the 1,000 numebr Vega? The one you pulled out of your ass after looking at a picture? Why is it you accept unquestioningly the numbers from Liberal news organizations while knee-jerk calling the numbers from the people on site “obvious lies”?

OBJECTIVELY? That word does not mean what you think it means, Vega.
http://www.patriotpost.com bthewolf

Provide PROOF that Gellar lied. That an officer DIDN't tell her this. And not just your best guess based on crappy close up videos from on the ground reporters. You claim she's lying you should be able to prove it! Does she need to prove she didn't lie? Do we need to find the officer?

All you have is YOUR guess, completely biased based solely on your uneducated opinion of how best to estimate crowds.
D-Vega

No, because there is nothing else that corraborates her statement, wolf. I am looking at it objectively. SOMEONE else would have said the same thing if indeed it was even 5,000 people. There's a BIG difference between 1,000 and 5,000 and 10,000.

http://www.patriotpost.com bthewolf

I'm wondering where you got you education crowd estimation. You seem to be an expert by the way you talk, so you must have training, right?

D-Vega

I am not an expert at crowd estimation, but I do have experience in protests, and observing protests, in NYC for many years.

And there have been independent sources of the crowd numbers, like The Daily News. Of course you would call them biased, because they won't subscribe to the lies from Gellar.

http://www.patriotpost.com bthewolf

So the reporters are as biased and untrained as you are, but they are infallible, while Gellar is a liar?!?! Got it, you're a hack, and a moron.

Video and photos are bad ways to estimate as they only capture brief segments at bad angles, and with a limited field of vision. And since you were not actaully there your skill at estimating is greatly supect since you're relying on the limited information provided in edited video clips and select photos.

Whether or not Gellar is lying is secondary to the FACT that your ability to estimate crowd size is BULLSHIT if you weren't there.

D-Vega

So the reporters are as biased and untrained as you are, but they are infallible, while Gellar is a liar?!?! Got it, you're a hack, and a moron.

Take a breath, wolf. If this protest was indeed 5K+ people, it would not only be obvious in footage, but also SOMEONE ELSE WOULD HAVE REPORTED IT THAT WAY. As it is, the only sources are Gellar and Spencer, who are biased because they want it to be reported as big as possible. And the rightwing media lapped it up.

Video and photos are bad ways to estimate as they only capture brief segments at bad angles, and with a limited field of vision. And since you were not actaully there your skill at estimating is greatly supect since you're relying on the limited information provided in edited video clips and select photos.

No, sorry. There is also NEWS REPORTS that state clearly there was about 1,000 people. AND THEY WERE THERE.

Fox News is based in NYC. What are Fox News' accounts on the numbers? You won't find them.

Whether or not Gellar is lying is secondary to the FACT that your ability to estimate crowd size is BULLSHIT if you weren't there.

No, whether Gellar is lying is the main point. That, and the fact that the right only had a problem with intimidation when it was found out that these men were Christians.
http://www.patriotpost.com bthewolf

All of which was is SUPPOSITION on your part, get it through your head, no matter what size the crowd was YOU have no credibility on the subject because you want the crowd to be as small as possible to down play the event!!!!
D-Vega

So she is correct, even though there is no support for her claim, besides her word. Why? Because she is an anti-muslim conservative. Even though her claim that the police told her something is a lie, because the police don't do that sort of thing, you are willing to give her the benefit of the doubt. Because she is an anti-muslim conservative.

While there are reports that give the 1,000 number, but all those people are liars. Because, according to conservatives, all these other reports are biased.
11Hotel

This is america, it is fine to be anti-muslim, it is also OK to believe ALL muslims are evil if you believe islam is an evil death cult.
Criticism of islam is on the rise, which it should be. All the moderates who behead people, clitorectomize their daughters, hang gays in public, stone women who have been raped-talked to a man-dress too western etc…

This is islam in all its glory for the world to see; it is not culture, it is backwards and barbaric and will continue to be exposed as such as time goes by as more video phones distribute around the world.

It is just unbelievable that the west has been so tolerant up to this point to put up with the barbarity; we are all cowards!!!

Mr. EMT

You say 1000 based off of your best guess.
I say 100,000 showed up.
You start counting, let me know when you manage to get past all your fingers and toes. I should be finished with my next shift by then.

Tom_pinko_Delay

It's nice to hear everyone condemn the moronic mob mentality that caused this incident, but what do you think caused it in the first place? “All Muslims are evil” rhetoric. The intolerant black eye that the right got over this is a perfect example of reaping what you sow.

StanW

Oh SHUT UP, you simpering idiot.

The hate and vitrol coming from the Left in this country give you and your ilk no moral high ground at all to lecture ANYONE on rhetoric.

Tom_pinko_Delay

Care to paint with a broader brush there, fella? Let's try and keep things to the matter at hand.

StanW

Oh that is RICH!

You can claim that the entire Right says all Muslims are evil and that caused this incident, yet you think *I* and painting with a broad brush?

The matter at hand is what a total idiot you are, Pinko.

Tom_pinko_Delay

Please refrain from putting words in my mouth, Stan. I never said that the “entire” Right says that all Muslims are evil. Some do, however, and that's what has led to this black eye for the right at large.

Do you think all Muslims are evil, Stan? what percentage?
StanW

but what do you think caused it in the first place? “All Muslims are evil” rhetoric. The intolerant black eye that the right got over this is a perfect example of reaping what you sow.

That is what YOU said, Pinko. Stop lying to try and change your own words.

Not all Muslims are evil. But many are!
Tom_pinko_Delay

Thanks for cutting and pasting my post again where it clearly does NOT say that I think the *entire* right believes all Muslims are evil.

Maybe if you read it a 3rd time you'll see how you added words that I never used?
StanW

So who did you mean, Pinko? You said the Right has a black eye from this incident. How many on the Right? Some of us or all of us? And how many on the Right said “All Muslims Are Evil”, as you lyingly asserted we have said?

How many, Pinko?
D-Vega

As many as there are who don't have a problem with this type of intimidation when it comes to muslims, but do have a problem with it when they victimize a Christian instead. Even now, the haters and fearers want to exploit the very same man they victimized.
StanW

The men were treated as such due to the bigotry and ignorance OF A FEW, Vega. Apologies have been issued.

And the exploited phrase is a lie and you know it. Nassralla is the one that jumped at the chance to speak at the next rally before he even knew there would be one.

You know, if we were to eliminate all your lying posts, you would not even need a posting name. I for one would appreciate the silence from you.
D-Vega

Apologies were issued because the men were Christian and now can be used to spread more hate and fear, Stan.

THAT is why they apologized. If these men were muslims, you wouldn't hear a damn thing. It's pathetic and shameful.
StanW

Again, stating your biased and bigoted opinion as fact of what someone else would do.

It is incredible how fucking pathetic you are, Vega!
D-Vega

There was no apology until Spencer found out they were Coptic Christians, Stan. Are you paying attention?
StanW

SO WHAT? They apologized.

I'm still waiting on you to apologize you a myriad of your lies. When are you going to grow a spine and stop lying, Vega?
D-Vega

Exactly, like I said, it was only because they were Christians.

It's okay with Spencer (author of Jihad Watch) to intimidate Muslims, but not okay when Christians are mistaken for muslims because of their brown skin.
StanW

Intimidate Muslims? You are bat-shit crazy, Vega.

You thing we intimadate Muslims that hold signs like “Behead those that insult Islam”?

Had these been Muslims that were there to peacefully watch the proceedings, I would feel EXACTLY the same. If, however, they had been ANYONE that was there for no other reason that to cause trouble or do violence like you on the Left love to do, then they should have been thrown out on their asses.
D-Vega

They were attempting to intimidate muslims, Stan. And they were made to look like fools when not only weren't these guys muslim (they were fooled by the brown skin) but they were there in support of the protest.
StanW

And the perpetrators were condemned for it, Vega. Your only bitch is your pathetic mind-reading skills in trying to tell us what we would have done.

But I was wrong, you CAN get more pathetic that you already are!
D-Vega

They were only condemned for it, because these guys were Christians.

Keep trying to run and hide and I'll just keep correcting you.
StanW

They were condemned for it, that is true. The reason they were condemned is becuase they did something stupid. It was NOT just because these guys were Christians.

You cannot read minds and you do NOT know why people do thins Vega. It makes you sould liek some pissy little bitch when you claim things as fact when they are not.

Perhaps when you go through puberty, you'll learn that telling the truth is easier. Until then, run away!
Mr. EMT

Kinda like how pathetic and shameful your hypocritical outrage is huh?
http://www.patriotpost.com bthewolf

Apologies were issued because they were treated badly, YOU can prove that the apologies were based solely on their religion, 'more supposistion' from 'Because I said so' Vega.
Mr. EMT

Let me know when you find someone involved who wouldn't apologize to them personally for the mistake in identity apparently made.

Tell me something moron, if they had actually been there as antagonists as the mob feared they were, would you be surprised that they had to be escorted out?
Funny thing, i haven't heard any account of ANY ACT OF VIOLENCE.
Totally opposite of what happens at leftist rally's where no reason is needed to turn the rally into a violent riot.
Mr. EMT

I say it.
But I am so far right the world tips in my favor.

Tell me the difference between someone who commits and evil act and someone who supports that evil act?
What is the difference between you and someone who commits outright treason pinkie?
D-Vega

I have to yet to see anyone on the right condemn this behavior outright, rather than with the “but he's a Christian” conditional, Stan.
StanW

Then you are blind as well as stupid, Vega.
D-Vega

Point it out, Stan.
StanW

From the CNN Article “Geller said the NYPD and security at the rally told her about 5,000 demonstrators were there.”

I'll accept your apology, as soon as you grow a pair!
D-Vega

GELLAR SAID not THE NYPD SAID.

Of course Gellar would say that. She needs some credibility in order to not look like a fool. Only 1,000 people in a metro area of 15 million is pathetic for something that is supposed to be spitting on the 9/11 graves.

That is the difference between a lie and fact. She lied, and now you are defending this lie.
StanW

YOU.
DO.
NOT.
KNOW.
SHE.
LIED.
Gellar said the police and security TOLD HER the number.

This is very simple Vega. Which is why it is so beyond your infantile grasp.

Tell us the story again of how the mosque isn't really a mosque.
D-Vega

The police didn't tell her squat, as the police confirmed that they don't do that. That means she lied.
StanW

The OFFICIAL POLICE SPOKESMAN said that the police do not publish offical crowd numbers. that in no way means that an officer at the scene did not tell here the crowd was around 5,000.

SO tell me something ASSHOLE. How do you know she is lying?
D-Vega

She has made the assertion, Stan. If she makes a claim, then the way to prove she is telling the truth is to confirm it independently.

So I looked for that. Other sources are putting the number at FAR lower, whereas any source that says the 5,000 or the more ridiculous 10,000 number all cite HER or SPENCER as the source.

Not the police. Not anyone else.

So two persons, with a huge amount of vested interest in a higher number, are the only sources for these hige numbers. And independent sources are saying much lower.

That means there is a problem with her credibility. Because if she is the only source, and she can't back up what she says, then that means she is lying.

10,000 is a big number, Stan. I have both organized and attended protests of that magnitude, which isn't that hard in NYC.

And that kind of protest shuts down the street. That kind of protest doesn't just take up sidewalk space.

They made a mistake lying about one in NYC, they should have stuck with D.C.
StanW

Sure you've organized protests, Vega. I doubt you could organize a sock drawer.

And if your resoning that Gellar is lying is that she needs to inflate the numbers to boost the rallies, then I will accept that.

And by that same standard, you and CNN (hardly an independent or reliable source) have a vested interest in lowering the numbers in order to dismiss this protest as a mere nothing (like an ice cream social).

So by your own standard, you have provided us all proof positive that YOU are lying about these numbers, Vega.

You are exposed and dismissed, Vega. Time for you to run away!
D-Vega

Still waiting for that independent source. ANY other source but Gellar and Spencer. You won't find it.
StanW

And I'm waiting on the same from you for the 1,000 number, Vega.
D-Vega

The Daily News. I gave you the link.

YOUR TURN.
StanW

So one of your sources says “More than 1,000″ while the other says 200-300. And your issue is with a police officer on scene telling Gellar there were 5,000 people there?

Seems your sources are wrong as well, Vega. But you'll beleive them because they fit your narrow and biased view of how the rally should have gone. Can't have too many people protesting something that you think is right, can we Vega.

By your own standard, that PROVES you are lying.
http://www.patriotpost.com bthewolf

Says the person needs to destroy Gellar's credibility since her ideas don't synch with yours.
Pork_Soda

F**ck 'em in the ear those twat hats! How's that for condemnation D?
Mr. EMT

I havent seen anyone on the left condemn their atrocities.
Not once since the Vietnam protests in the 70's.

Btw, William Ayers called to say you are doing a great job, Vag.

Mr. EMT

Pinkie, you are missing from that code pink rally
How many commie “peace protests” envolved spitting on our soldiers?
How many of your religious and political protests have resulted in riots?

Someone remind me, how long did that tollerant and peaceful demonstration by muslims last in australia a few years back that resulted in millions of dollars in damage?
Or the one in greece?

And you simpering bitches sit there and DARE complain that at this rally, 2 people who were supportive, yet speaking a language that totally exluded them from everyone else at the protest, were singled out and treated “rudely.”

To me it is amazing considering if things were on the other foot they would be lucky to be alive if they had been Hebrews showing up to a muslim rally. Or soldiers in uniform at a brown shirt rally… or a lot of other comparisons we could make.

Tom_pinko_Delay

And you simpering bitches sit there and DARE complain that at this rally, 2 people who were supportive, yet speaking a language that totally exluded them from everyone else at the protest, were singled out and treated “rudely.”

So they had it coming because they weren't speaking English? They were talking to people back in their studio you ignorant fool! And even if they were just talking to each other, it sounds like you are justifying the actions against them strictly because they weren't speaking English. You obviously have no clue as to what life is actually like in New York City.

To me it is amazing considering if things were on the other foot they would be lucky to be alive if they had been Hebrews showing up to a muslim rally. Or soldiers in uniform at a brown shirt rally… or a lot of other comparisons we could make.

Then why did they have seek help from the police?

TheDickNixon

Quoting people again TPD? Remember how that worked out when you were proven to make up quotes attributed to CavalierX and got called on it and proven to have invented said quote?

Nixon remembers.

Tom_pinko_Delay

The quote in question was: “McCain will win, and I'm never wrong about anything,” which coming out of my mouth *speaking* as Cav should have been clear as day that is was sarcasm. In a written format, though, sometimes it can be hard to discern sarcasm, so in that very same thread I acknowledged that I should have indicated *sarcasm* in the original post.

That you continue to reference this incident as if it were some big scandal only demonstrates how clueless you are.

TheDickNixon

Actually you directly attributed that to Cavalier X, and there was no sarcasm in your tone. But it's ok, admitted liars do have a chance at reforming themselves. Just look at Clinton sending a fundraising piece out pointing out a GOP member may have visited a hooker, while Bill busted a nut in the Oval Office. Redemption Tom, hopefully you get some.

Tom_pinko_Delay

As I just said, sometimes sarcasm is hard to read, and I should have taken more care to make my intentions known. You consider that lying? Again, clueless is and clueless does.
TheDickNixon

Nixon does consider making up quotes and attributing them to other posters lying. As is coming back and saying it was sarcasm when no sarcasm was indicated in the post.

Your opinion (which resembles what comes out of Nixon's dog's ass) may vary. Have a great day TPD.

Mr. EMT

Ya know… somehow I think if muslims had not have supported the 911 attacks and had totally ostracized the terrorists on the plans this would not have happened? Instead we got to watch the celebrations across the planet when islam “struck at the heart of the infidel”
Instead, here we are at war across the world with them.
We have to deal with islamists who want to honor kill their family member, in America. We have to fight islamists who behead innocents they kidnap. We have to sit back and idly watch islamist regimes rape children, torture people… and we are told we are wrong for judging those acts?

Your'e damn right I'm intolerant of this behavior.
I would ask why you are supportive, but lets face it pinkie, you are a commie shit head that doesn't deserve to set foot on American Soil.

D-Vega

Geller said the NYPD and security at the rally told her about 5,000 demonstrators were there. But NYPD spokesman Sgt. Kevin Hayes said the police department's policy is to not provide crowd estimates and that he could not confirm Geller's number.

CNN iReporter Julio Ortiz-Teissonniere, who attended the rally and sent photos to CNN, said the number was closer to 200-300 while he was there for the first 45 minutes of the event. All three said the protest was peaceful.

Wow. So even if the CNN reporter is lying (and that would be a big difference, between 300 and 10,000), we know for sure that Gellar is lying.

Figures.

StanW

we know for sure that Gellar is lying.

You do not know anything of the sort, Vega. Stop being an arrogant prick!

D-Vega

Yeah, she is, because the police didn't tell her squat. She pulled it out of thin air to make her rally seem bigger than it was. She's a liar.

StanW

You were not there and do not know SHIT, Vega. You state something as fact when you know NOTHING!

So shut the fuck up!

D-Vega

She is a liar, Stan. And now she has been proven to be one.

She has to lie, because you can attract more than 1,000 people in NYC with ice cream, and this was a big deal for her and her site so she has to lie.

Otherwise it would seem like this isn't really that big of a deal. And she can't have that.
StanW

You don't know that she is lying, Vega. And your track record for telling the truth is in negative numbers. Stop assreting something as fact when you don't know.

YOU were not there.
YOU didn't see the crowds.
YOU don't know what the police on scene did or did not say to Gellar.
YOU are a liar!
D-Vega

I did see the crowds on TV, Stan. Actual footage, not close-up photos.
StanW

And you were standing Next to Gellar and heard every word spoken to her by the Police and Security detail?
Yeah, I didn't think so.

Oh, and was that on CNN TV, they of the 200-300 people there? Still waiting on your stinging rebuttal of their lie!
D-Vega

Damn, you sure are giving Gellar A LOT of credit.

So you are saying you believe her, over any other media source, the actual photos and other eyewitness accounts? That certainly figures.
TheDickNixon

Yeah Vega, the media never lies. Only conservatives. That koolaid grape or fruit punch flavored today?
D-Vega

Yeah, Nixon. Conservatives never lie. Only media.
TheDickNixon

You read any of that unbiased media coverage of the Israeli's boarding that ship Vega? The one with the cropped picture, Vega?

MemoGate Vega? The media tried to rig a Presidential election, and Rather took the fall for the forged memo's.

Thanks for playing. You and your unbiased media have a nice big drink of koolaid. Or do you prefer whine with your cheese? LOL, you f'n dufus.
D-Vega

Can you prove anything was biased in this reporting, Nixon?

No? Thanks for playing.
TheDickNixon

You are the one saying Pam was lying. Without proof of the lie.

That is the subject of your screed Vega. Also, you are the one who claims that the MSM is unbiased, regardless of the facts.

Denial. Thanks Vega for the attempt. Try harder next time, if you will.
Mr. EMT

So wait… Tv was shown of a rally with what you claim is a few hundred people in new york?
Really? Why did the news bother then?
Cnn showed up for a rally of only 300 people?
This would have made the news for how pathetic the numbers were on every network, if it were true.
Mr. EMT

You honestly think for a minute 10k in New York wouldnt show up?
That everyone is smoking from the bong of peace and love and wants a mosque standing where muslims slaughtered three thousand of our citizens?
I can't believe you are able to keep your fingers on the keys to type, as slippery as it is from your drool.
Slobbering moron.
D-Vega

10K people could have shown up, but they didn't. About 1,000 did. And then Gellar lied by saying police estimate 5,000, when there is no proof that they did. And then the rightwing media lapped that up and even now claims 10,000, which the attendance was NO WHERE near that.

It's a viral lie.
Bthewolf

You still have NO proof she lied, only YOU supposition, which suoorts your need to down play the scale of this event.
D-Vega

The proof is in there is nothing supporting her claim, while there is support that points to a much smaller crowd.
Mr. EMT

Looking at the pictures kinda shows totally different story from what you try to depict.
Simple math, which I know, you totally failed the education system and I am at a better advantage than you because of practice guestimating mobs.
One angle of the rally showed protestors shoulder to shoulder covering a very large area of an intersection. Looks roughly the size of two football fields? http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs…
Say 500 by 100 yards for easy math, give each person 3sq feet of space to occupy. How do you like those numbers?
D-Vega

That's not two football fields. A NYC block is anywhere from 350-500 ft long. So two football fields would be at least two blocks.

I have been at rallies where we had 5,000+ people, and it takes up at least three blocks.
Mr. EMT

Vega? A football field is 100 yards long.
1 yard has 3 feet.
350 feet is longer than one football field. 500 feet is nearly 2 football fields.

The angle shot appears to be of an intersection covering at least 2 blocks. That angle is a fraction of the crowd that is there.
Thanks for playing sport.

StanW

And you know that a cop on the scene did not tell here that he thought there were about 5,000 people there BECAUSE?

Oh, that's right. You are a lying bastard and don;t know ANYTHING!

D-Vega

What cop? Where? So we should believe Gellar because…?
StanW

What Mosque, where? Oh, that one right there.

Why should we believe YOU, asshole?
D-Vega

Don't be mad because your hero is a liar, Stan.
StanW

You are NOT my hero, Vega.
TheDickNixon

And you are saying she is lying because she is a conservative or anti jihad, which Vega?
D-Vega

I am saying she is a liar because no one else, not even Fox News, can corraborate her story.

It doesn't matter whether she is a conservative or because she hates muslims. Facts are facts. Hers don't add up. She is a liar.
TheDickNixon

Since you popped off Vega, can you prove she is lying? Or are you just making shit up? You made the statement she is lying. Prove it.

Do it Vega. Prove Pam is lying. Nixon will post the proof on the Nixon Tape and credit you. Nixon's 7 readers will know you were right.

Nixon will prepare popcorn and wait.
StanW

He already proved it, Nixon, by using his standard proof for everything…

“Because I Said So”

It's very sad, but in his defense… it's all he's got!
TheDickNixon

Never thought Nixon would see a supposed New Yorker defend Islam building a mosque right by Ground Zero, and opposing those who demonstrate against said building.
D-Vega

There are two reports that vastly contradict her claim, whereas there is no other independent report that back up her claim, including the police.

DONE.

Thanks for playing.
Mr. EMT

Just clerifying…
Due to lack of any other evidence you say give no benefit of the doubt.

Brianna

I was at the march 20 healthcare protest in DC. The estimate I got from the DC cops was 30,000; the estimate from the speakers was 40,000.

The MSM, on the other hand, reported “a few thousand.” Go figure.

These days, whenever I hear about a protest by conservatives or tea partiers, I usually take the MSM number and multiply it by 5 to 10. This is the best way to get an accurate figure out of them. Just look at the 9-12 march, which was billed at 70,000; but if you go on YouTube to watch the march videos, you can see that this number is ludicrously small. Go watch those videos, and you will know that what I say is true.

D-Vega

It wasn't 2 million though, which is what the rightwing was claiming.

Pork_Soda

Thank you John for this follow up! I am glad to hear Joesph Nassralla will get the opportunity to speak. I can't begin to imagine how persecuted Coptic Christians are in the ME.
TheDickNixon

It's good to see a private citizen like Pam Geller stepping up to help lead the fight against militant Islam. 15% of Muslims worldwide are estimated to share jihadist beliefs per Jihad Watch, Dhimmi Watch, and other sources, theu giving approximately 150 million people who support violent jihad against the west.

It's also good to see liberals here opposing the actions of private US citizens who oppose the Jihadists. Of course, this is expected as Pam is a conservative.

What was done, if it occurred as described by this Coptic Christian, wsa very wrong, and Nixon is pleased to see him invited to speak at the next rally. Nixon supposes that our leftists friends hate to see such a move, but that is due to their political beliefs more than any sense of fairness.

Islam is a false religion, a 7th century death cult if you will. Robert Spencer at Jihad Watch and Pam Geller at Atlas Shrugs are leaders in opposing this cult, and are attacked daily for their beliefs. When you are right it is easy to be hated by the left.

D-Vega

This had nothing to do with the fight against militant Islam.

This was spreading fear and hatred of an entire religion. The same thing you are doing in your post. Very sad.

Gellar is a hack who feeds off this nonsense. And that's why she had to lie about the attendance number.

TheDickNixon

“This had nothing to do with the fight against militant Islam. “

you are correct Vega. it was militant methodists that brought down the Twin Towers murdering 2900 innocent people. Thanks for the correction. Why do you hate Pam Vega, because she is a conservative or anti Jihadists? As there is really no other reason Nixon can see for your hatred. And Nixon thought you leftists preached tolerance.

Tolerance on your terms, eh Vega? And it isn't Nixon's fault Islam is a pagan religion. Christ didn't endorse it, why should Nixon?

D-Vega

Intimidating brown men because you think they are muslim, and protesting a building of a place that denounces militantcy, JUST because it's muslim, has nothing to do with a fight against militant Islam.

It has everything to do with spreading fear and hatred of Islam.

TheDickNixon

Well Vega, you can organize the counter protest, since you are so passionate about the subject.
Bthewolf

They CLAIM to denounce militant Islam just like Pam Gellar CLAIMS to have talked to a police officer, it's interestisng who's word you are willing to take at face value, and who you dismiss.
D-Vega

Considering there are reports that contradict her statement, then yes.
Brianna

They were not intimidated for being brown. They were intimidated because they were speaking arabic and passing out quranic (sp?) passages, and were thus thought to be muslims who had infiltrated the rally to speak in favor of the mosque.

Nobody cares whether muslims or christians are white or brown. They care whether they are muslim or christian, and specifically, whether they are willing to practice their religion within the framework of the US laws and consititution or whether they view themselves as “muslims first, americans second”

Bthewolf

Right Vega, because you are willing to take them at their word but not Pam Gellar. What a maroon!

D-Vega

Why should I take Gellar's, a muslim hater, opinion over someone else?

mightysamurai

Sounds to me like D-Vega's pissy because the right has the moral integrity to criticize our own for doing something wrong, whereas the left never apologizes for incidents like the SEIU mobbing a man's house to cover up their unpaid debts.

StanW

D-Vega is pissy because he has been nothing but a pissy little bitch since Obama came on the scene. I doubt we'll ever see the previous Vega again!

D-Vega

Seems to me like you are the one who is the resident cranky guy, Stan.

StanW

That might be the case, Vega… IF no one but me could see your posts. Unfortunately FOR YOU, everyone on this board can see for themselves what an arrogant and pompous ass you are.

Time for you to run away AGAIN!

D-Vega

I was simply making a point. This kind of behavior is wrong no matter what.

Unions staking out in front of people's personal homes is out of line, too. As you can easily camp out in front of their offices.

Boorish behavior eventually ends up with somone getting hurt or arrested.

Mr. EMT

Ring side seats watching John Hawkins sharing his meal of crow with pinkie, vag, fiz and the other lefty libtards is hilarious.
Hey vag, the answer is 50,000 btw. You can cut it in half if you want to give people 6 square feet if personal space. Try guessing what that number adds up to.
Brianna

A relief. Many thanks for your footwork, and for getting the truth that the MSM was too lazy to bother with.

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