Sometimes you have to set traps and disappear for awhile to get the bugs to come out. My own belief is that we should not be cleaning up Afghanistan. We can't want a democratic nation for them more than they want it for themselves. Instead, let things go back to whatever they want over there. If they step out of line, go back in and smash the bugs again once they're out in the open again.

Obviously you either don't listen or are too stupid to retain the fact that Americans regardless of political affiliation have supported the war in Afghanistan from the beginning.

Posted by Robert_Ingersoll

2009-10-14 10:20:43

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/extra/features/july-dec01/peace_protest.html

In Berkeley, California, people were on the streets in protest, even before the military strikes began. Their demonstrations and rallies calling for a "non-military approach" to capturing terrorist Osama bin Laden was also represented in Capitol Hill.

You are too stupid to be alive, please go curl up in a corner, and kindly STFU. You have now been relegated to the heap of irrelavant trolls smacked down at RWN. May you rot in your own ignorance.

>> In Berkeley, California, people were on the streets in protest, even before the military strikes began. Their demonstrations and rallies calling for a "non-military approach" to capturing terrorist Osama bin Laden was also represented in Capitol Hill.

He said "Americans", not Berkleyites, were for the war.

Posted by happirick

2009-10-14 11:34:52

LOL!! Yeah I guess I missed that, of course Berkley is, regrettably(sp), in the US, so you can see where I could make that mistake.

Dear Big

Thank you for the kind words. Now, onto your points:

1. I am saying that we are not any good at nation building – we don't have the stomach for what it takes to first maintain order, a precondition to democracy. We ARE very good at blowing things up though and in a short time – just the attention span that this nation has. Just because we destroyed the Taliban govt 8 years ago does not mean we have to remain in Afghanistan forever trying to build something there. We should certainly monitor the situation if we're not there. If the Taliban takes over again, well that's the business of the Afghans. If we keep our eyes open and determine that they are once again a threat, then it would be ok to take them out again.

2. Sarcasm – look it up in a dictionary.

Yeah the US is so bad at nation building Japan, Germany and Iraq have all become horrible dicatorships again.

Those were examples of nation building? Perhaps you mean something different by that term than…. well nearly every one else on earth.

"You would have to explain your definition first, CT."

Uh, nation building is defined as building nations.

Somalia, Bosnia, Lebanon, Vietnam, and the others were police actions. Bush correctly determined that painting bullseyes on our troops and sending them to patrol hostile dictatorships probably wasn't a good idea. Everything he did was based on regieme change and the establishment of democracy…an action with a historically good success rate.

Lo and behold, the Iraq War is won with US troops out of the cities and preparing to leave, and the terrorists are throwing everything they can at Afghanistan in a last ditch effort to maintain a foothold there. As opposed to Somalia (failed state), Bosnia (still a UN refugee camp), Lebanon (failed state run by Iran), and Vietnam (Communist South China).

The Iraq War is won and we are preparing to leave? Really, Mike?

Yes, really. The troops are scheduled to begin withdrawing shortly, as per the plan set forth by President Bush (you know, the one Obama illegally tried to derail during the 08 campaign?).

*post-elections…damn this keyboard!

You would have to explain your definition first, CT. As those other countries as examples of nation-building. Failures, but still attempts at nation-building.

Posted by D-Vega

2009-10-14 15:13:12

There is a difference in the lists. Germany, Japan, South Korea were all rebuilt by America. Your examples, Bosnia, Somalia, Lebanon were all place the UN was involved in the nation building. When the focus is on building a democracy vs. setting up kiddie brothels, nation building works.

"The Iraq War is won and we are preparing to leave? Really, Mike?"

Uh yeah. Checked the news lately?

Maybe Obama can redeploy troops to Chicago…which is now more dangerous than Baghdad.

Yeah different era, different culture, nobody can bring democracy to the heathen Japanese, they have never had such a thing… oops… well nobody can bring democracy to Iraq, they've never had such a thing… oops…

Maybe people take to democracy naturally and its in all of us, the longing for liberty. Maybe it works everywhere, and some folks just don't care for certain people to be free.